Next week, in the German capital of Berlin, dozens of European football’s leading executives will gather together at the general assembly of the European Club Association (ECA).
The ECA is a collective body whose function is to represent the interests of clubs in European football — primarily those who regularly or occasionally compete in UEFA club competitions such as the Champions League, Europa League and Europa Conference League — and lobby for change at the governing bodies and competition organisers UEFA and FIFA.
In September, the organisation will hold elections for representation on the board of the ECA and Sergei Palkin, the chief executive of Ukrainian Champions Shakhtar Donetsk, will be among those vying for votes.
This week, ahead of the elections, Palkin, 48, spoke to The Athletic for a wide-ranging question-and-answer session, in which he discusses the state of Ukrainian football in the midst of a war, the behaviour of the Spanish FA president Luis Rubiales, the challenges posed by the Saudi Pro League, whether Champions League matches should ever be taken out of Europe and the future of broadcasting in sport.
Here is what he had to say…
The Athletic: Why do you want to join the board of the ECA?
Palkin: Since the war in Ukraine started a year and a half ago, it has shown where the organisation of football is weak, particularly in how we react in a non-standard force majeure situation, and therefore, we need to change a lot.
So I made a decision to go for the ECA because a lot of good things are already being done but we have space to improve.
What is the situation of Ukrainian football at the start of this season, as the war continues following the Russian invasion of the country?
To be honest, for Ukrainian football, it is catastrophic. No fans are allowed to visit stadiums, so games are played behind closed doors. We have almost zero income domestically in Ukraine, in terms of sponsorships, matchday income, ticketing and television rights.
The only option we have is to sell our (Ukrainian) players abroad (because FIFA introduced a ruling that means foreign players can unilaterally suspend their contracts during the war and join clubs outside Ukraine without a transfer fee).
FIFA have stolen our capability to sell some players and that’s it. Then, OK, three or four Ukrainian clubs participate in European competitions and they can receive bonuses from competing in European competitions.
And from these bonuses, they can live and they can more or less survive. But if we are talking about the other twelve clubs in the Ukrainian Premier League, the situation is catastrophic. And we are enduring this problem alone in football.
This is the biggest question. When I will try to be elected, I will try and raise some policies. And one of the policies is about solidarity because in recent years things have happened that require solidarity. First, we had a pandemic. Then we have a war in Ukraine. After that, we have an earthquake in Turkey. We need to create a solidarity fund, which is used to help in these kinds of situations. This fund can be used in force majeure situations to support people who truly need it.
If Ukrainian clubs outside of the Champions League or the Europa League do not receive external support, how long will they be able to survive if the war continues?
Many Ukrainian clubs have problems and I am in contact with their management and owners. I already feel that some of them are becoming completely bankrupt. Some of them are even saying that they don’t know how to survive until the end of the season.
Is there any state support coming from within Ukraine?
For the Ukrainian government, there are understandably different priorities and they know who to support in this situation. Football is in the last position now.
What does the ECA need to change?
I feel that this association can have the power to change many things and to make football much better. This association was created to promote respect, support and collaboration with all football stakeholders. One thing I would like to see is for the ECA to open their doors for more clubs because everybody needs support and expertise. The ECA is trying to develop ideas, for example around academy development and women’s football. But it does not need to be confined to an elite group of clubs.
We should open the doors so all clubs can access this kind of knowledge, analytical data and information. We do not need to be an elite club only for those football clubs which participate in European competitions.
Smaller clubs also have the right to improve and to have access to any information and database we may have and also provide their perspective and knowledge to inform decisions made in the world of football.
One of the biggest issues that faced the ECA came in April 2021, when the organisation was blindsided by an attempt to launch a European Super League. Do you think that by having more of the so-called smaller or medium-sized clubs in the room, a Super League becomes less likely to happen because there’s more representation from clubs lower down the pyramid?
Yes, definitely. Even in the ECA, I can feel that big clubs have more power and influence here. We don’t need to do it that way. We need to give more of a voice to middling clubs and smaller clubs. Take, for example, the distribution of money we received in the Champions League last season. Shakhtar won more points than Juventus, but they received more money. If we are participating in the same competition and our club receives more points, how we can receive less money?
The disparity you refer to relates to the way money is shared in the group stages of the Champions League, because up to 45 per cent of the money is distributed according to formulas that weigh the television market share of a competing team, as well as the co-efficient performance of a competing team over a ten-year period, which means the most famous and wealthy clubs in Europe are always likely to receive more.
To play devil’s advocate, I suppose they would argue that more people are likely to watch the Champions League if you have Juventus playing. They would say they bring the audience, which in turn brings the revenue and therefore they may feel they are entitled to a bigger share.
Yes, you are right. They can answer like that. But by always doing this, stronger clubs become stronger and weak clubs became weaker. From some point of view, what you say is right. But we need to analyse this situation to look at the long-term development of football and make some kind of decision. When we are in one competition, we need to have some form of equal rights. I am not even saying completely equal, but just a more balanced distribution of prize money.
Do you think these bigger clubs are given more money because UEFA and also the ECA are scared that if they do not give the big clubs more money, they will run off and do another Super League?
Yes, maybe they are trying to find some kind of compromise in order to control the situation. But we tried all these compromises before and in the end they still went off and tried to create the Super League. They didn’t care about everything we had done for them. They didn’t care about what the ECA did for them. They just stood up and said, ”OK, thank you very much, but we will do what we want.”
You want to be on the ECA board, a body that helps shape the future of the game. So I wanted to discuss some broader issues.
Let’s start with the Saudi Pro League. Europe has for a long time been seen as the top continent for investment in football, but now there is a lot of money being invested in the Saudi Pro League. Clubs within Europe must comply with UEFA’s Financial Fair Play rules, but outside Europe there are not the same financial restrictions. How should European football respond to Saudi Arabia?
First of all, we need to understand our own development strategy for European leagues. If I take the Ukrainian league, what kind of strategy do we have to develop and receive more income? And I want to see ECA representatives help us to develop this strategy. This should be the case for all leagues, the same for Spain and England too. They should have a strategy, asking how to bring more income, more fans and how to promote football.
Then if you take the Saudi league or MLS and look at how they invest and how they bring the stars, we should analyse whether it will bring a positive effect to European clubs and leagues or not.
Some people have started to mention that one day, the Saudi league may have representatives in the Champions League because they are taking a lot of talent from Europe and, who knows, maybe in the future, broadcasters will say we still want these players in the Champions League. So do you think, in five or ten years’ time, you could have two Saudi clubs in the European Champions League or maybe a couple from MLS?
To be honest, I don’t want to support this kind of idea because I’m quite traditional in this area. Of course, money and income is very important but the history can be more important.
The top clubs wanted to create that Super League to receive more money. It would be the same story in respect of bringing Saudi or MLS clubs to the Champions League.
OK, another one. We have reported in the past that some ECA executives have previously discussed the possibility of taking some Champions League games or maybe the final outside of Europe. So you could play a final in New York or Miami or Riyadh or wherever. Do you think this idea is more realistic, to take some Champions League games and grow the product outside of Europe?
Now this idea is quite interesting and it is one I would support definitely because this is directed to the promotion of European football. Therefore, yes, we should consider these kinds of choices to bring our European football to, for example, the U.S. or different continents. It will be quite interesting. Why not?
I think a lot of clubs would agree with you but also a lot of domestic football fans would want it to remain in Europe. English football supporters in particular have proven consistently to be very traditional in these conversations. Do you think clubs and UEFA would have to really help supporters with the costs of travel if such developments came?
First of all, we should analyse everything, before talking about operational issues. But we need to be open-minded and I would support this idea to promote football for fans outside of Europe and make these steps to develop European football.
One of the big stories this week has been the Spanish FA president Luis Rubiales, who is also the vice-president of UEFA, after Spanish footballer Jenni Hermoso said she did not consent to an on-pitch kiss by Rubiales following the World Cup final. FIFA have provisionally suspended Rubiales for three months. How have you seen those events?
First of all, what’s happened, these actions are completely inappropriate and unacceptable. FIFA, as I understand it, has provisionally suspended him from all football-related activities. I believe that they are now doing an investigation and I believe that they will make the right decision and we will support them on this.
What he did is unacceptable. The whole world is watching this tournament and he is there doing these kinds of actions.
It’s completely catastrophic what he did. I believe that UEFA and FIFA will make the proper decisions.
In modern football, there are different investment models at different clubs. We could talk about clubs that are linked in some way to nation-states or private equity investment. I could also refer to Shakhtar, whose owner Rinat Akhmetov is a very rich businessman and the wealthiest man in Ukraine, who has provided funding.
Some people fear that the competitive balance of domestic leagues is made very difficult because some clubs potentially have access to resources that are far bigger than others. Do you think that UEFA’s Financial Fair Play is sufficient to control that?
First of all, I support the idea that if there are rich people or funds who want to invest into football, it’s good for the development of football. It’s very positive because if the owner of some European club buys a player for $200m (£158m; €184m) from Benfica, for example, then that money goes to develop football at Benfica and in Lisbon.
They can invest the money in their academy and across their club. Of course, we need to pay attention to FFP and ensure that clubs meet these criteria, but maybe we do need to sit again and analyse what kind of criteria needs to be met. And it should be tough to meet FFP.
But if the Saudi league buys players for €50m or €100m or €200m, then it is all just money coming into European football because they are mostly buying players from European clubs. So, for me, if the Saudis want to buy those players, I am not too worried, because I am telling you, 100 per cent, new stars will appear very quickly in Europe and the money can be invested into academies and infrastructure, to create better stadiums and structures, taking our football to another level.
OK, just to go back to the competitive balance. We could talk about Bayern Munich, who have won eleven consecutive league titles in Germany, or Shakhtar, who have won 10 of the previous 13 Ukrainian championships. Is that a cycle or is that something now embedded because they are the teams who have the highest revenues?
If you will look at European leagues, there are some where one club wins maybe 70 per cent of the domestic championships. But in our league, 15 or 20 years ago, the situation was different and then we became stronger and started to win. We also worked very hard as well as receiving investment. But this season, for example, nobody knows who will become champion in Ukraine. We have a minimum of five candidates.
One of the new initiatives this season is that FIFA have directed club matches to include additional added time at the end of each half, while it feels as though there is more football than ever each year. We have seen players such as Raphael Varane of Manchester United warn that player welfare is increasingly at risk due to the increased demands of the football calendar. Does this worry you?
I don’t like to have a situation where players start to play more and more games. Do you know why? Because I see the reason for more games and longer games is about generating more money. It’s not a question of developing football or promoting football, it’s a question of generating more money. Do you remember that FIFA wanted to have the World Cup every two years? It’s the same story.
I don’t want to increase the number of games just because somebody wants to receive more money. If it’s related to developing football, or the promotion of football, then it is a different story.
OK, last topic. Let’s talk about the future of broadcasting in football in a world where people’s consumption habits are changing. There is so much conversation around streaming platforms or direct-to-consumer models. Do you expect traditional linear television deals to be the future or is that going to change?
I think it will change, completely, because in the end European clubs or UEFA will arrive at a situation where we will have a prototype where if you want to see a Champions League game, you can buy it directly from UEFA. I imagine it will be the same for the television rights in our domestic league in the future, where the league will create a platform like Netflix and fans can go inside the platform and choose what kind of match they wish to watch. We don’t need intermediaries. Eventually, we will see the development of these kind of platforms.
So if you had that as an in-house platform, would you distribute the money equally between every club in the competition, or would it be based on who is watched the most? For example, I would imagine that far more people would buy the ticket to watch Real Madrid than they would for Sparta Prague in the same competition.
I understand you completely because, to be honest, now we are discussing creating this kind of platform in Ukraine. There are the same questions over how we will distribute the revenue. Within the Ukrainian market, our club can generate more money than other teams in the league but to me that does not mean that those other clubs should receive less. Now we are discussing a formula.
This formula should be fair and, definitely, we don’t want to receive all the money just for Shakhtar or Dynamo Kyiv. For us, it’s very important to develop small and medium-sized clubs because if they are strong, we will be also stronger and we will be able to compete in competitions like the Champions League and the Europa League. Therefore we need to work out a formula that allows them to develop.
(Top photo: Matteo Ciambelli/NurPhoto via Getty Images)
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